JS-Kit/Echo comments for article at http://smallestminority.blogspot.com/2009/12/gun-you-carry.html (24 comments)

  Tentative mapping of comments to original article, corrections solicited.

jsid-1260051473-617300  mthead at Sat, 05 Dec 2009 22:17:53 +0000

I've had a Kel-tec in .40s&w, for years now and love it. Don't feel bad if it becomes your favorite pocket gun. With your flashy 1911 sitting in the safe all the time. It's kind of like going with a street tramp, and leaving your trophy wife at home. They just seem to become one of those things that stay in your pocket all the time like a knife.

jsid-1260052797-617303  Sergeant Mac at Sat, 05 Dec 2009 22:39:57 +0000

I'm 6'4 and 315 lbs, and I can conceal a 5" 1911 all summer long under a tank top....in a BELT holster.

(tank tops tend to run a little longer than T-shirts, and looser)

Failing that, there's always the IWB holster and guayabera shirt combo.

You can either start with your wardrobe, and pick your gun based upon that, or start with your gun, and pick your wardrobe based upon it.

Then again, I'm one of those fanatics that believes that guns are supposed to be comfortING, not comfortABLE.

jsid-1260055704-617304  theirritablearchitect at Sat, 05 Dec 2009 23:28:24 +0000

Looking into picking up one of those myself.

Do let us know how it shoots.

jsid-1260056745-617305  Unix-Jedi at Sat, 05 Dec 2009 23:45:45 +0000

I've got it's predecessor.

P-11. I have to say, I wasn't happy with it. I fluffed and buffed and buffed and fluffed and fluffed and...

It jammed. A lot. With every sort of ammo. And shot *really* low. As in at 7-25 yards, holding the front sight OVER the back shot to PO"A".

And then tried a new moly-lube, and got 5 mags through without a jam. Moved up to good defensive HPs, 3 mags fine. Then something broke between the hammer and the trigger.

The good news is that Kel-Tec has a lifetime warranty. (I just have a aversion to packaging and sending guns.)

But I'm not sure it would be really *trustworthy*. So I haven't send it in yet.

jsid-1260061658-617306  Kevin Baker at Sun, 06 Dec 2009 01:07:38 +0000

Sergeant Mac, I tuck my shirts in. This means I need something additional OVER my shirt. Not really gonna happen at 105ºF. Easy at 65º.

jsid-1260062429-617307  Unix-Jedi at Sun, 06 Dec 2009 01:20:29 +0000


I tuck and usually carry a Browning Hi-Power, with a G-30 if for some reason that's not available, and a Colt Commander as the 3rd string.

What's wrong with that?

What I want: (but they didn't have last time I ordered)

What I've got now for the BHP and G-30:

jsid-1260068432-617308  Thirdpower at Sun, 06 Dec 2009 03:00:32 +0000

Both the wife and mother have P32's. I bought an extended mag for the wife's otherwise it's to small for me to use.

They jam occasionally but are easy to clear.

jsid-1260072798-617310  Kevin Baker at Sun, 06 Dec 2009 04:13:18 +0000

My 1911 holster is a Minotaur. I still need an outer garment to cover it.

jsid-1260073471-617311  Sergeant Mac at Sun, 06 Dec 2009 04:24:31 +0000

I keep forgetting that other people NEED to conceal their weapons while they're at WORK....

Yeah, if that was me, I'd probably be looking at something a bit smaller that'd carry nicely in a pocket or ankle holster.

....or maybe a holster shirt.

jsid-1260073576-617312  Sergeant Mac at Sun, 06 Dec 2009 04:26:16 +0000

You could try SmartCarry, but with a full-sized pistol, I'm thinking that if it wasn't OBVIOUS, you might still find yourself on the receiving end of some unwanted curiousity....:o)

jsid-1260075153-617313  Nate at Sun, 06 Dec 2009 04:52:33 +0000

Kevin, I have this gun and carry it often. It's just a little big for my pocket so I put it in a Crossbreed IWB, tuckable holster. I really recommend this holster and pistol combo. My PF-9 has been 100% reliable and accurate enough for defensive duty. I actually traded away a P11 for this gun because the double stacker was just a little too blocky.

I think you will find that Kel-Tec has been working hard on sending out guns that work right out of the box.

jsid-1260075287-617314  Nate at Sun, 06 Dec 2009 04:54:47 +0000

One more thing, if your gun doesn't have a metal magazine catch, I recommend replacing it. The coompany has them on their website for $5.95. The plastic ones wear out pretty quickly.

jsid-1260076722-617315  Unix-Jedi at Sun, 06 Dec 2009 05:18:42 +0000


Why do you need cover over that? Printing, not being able to draw or?

Just confused, never had a problem.

Well, other than needing JC Penny Extra-Tall shirts on occasion.

Other than that, what do you think of the Minotaur?

jsid-1260107706-617320  Tony Trauring at Sun, 06 Dec 2009 13:55:06 +0000

My solution to being a wide load and carrying concealed is a clip-on side pack from BagMaster (http://www.bagmaster.com/cart/products/44/Belt%20Pistol%20Pack%20Large.htm). It zips up, holds my Ruger P89 upright. I loosen the zipper when I'm worried about trouble... It's not a quick-draw holster, but no concealed holster is. When I wear the pack people assume I'm carrying my iphone or a camera. In fact there is room in the outside pocket for my phone, a flashlight, and my reading glasses. I carry my checkbook and passport inside the zippered part with my Ruger, along with an extra 15 round clip.

You don't really walk around with a revolver in your pocket, do you?!?!?!?

jsid-1260112047-617321  ExurbanKevin at Sun, 06 Dec 2009 15:07:27 +0000

I have a very similar gun, the Sccy CPX-1, and I like it. It's small, flat, accurate (enough), gives me 10+1 shots of 9mm Gold-Dots and disappears completely in a pocket holster in the front pocket of a pair of khakis.

It does have it's limitations, though. I used it in an NRA Personal Protection class and after an hour of shooting, the receiver warmed up and locked the slide. Not the sort of thing that worries me, though, because if I'm in a gunfight for an hour with it, something's gone REALLY wrong. :)

I bought the CPX-1 because at the time, it was the most amount of firepower I could safely carry to work (business casual is a bear for concealment). My work doesn't have a "no guns" policy, but that could easily change if someone freaks out about one of their cow-orkers carrying a gun to work.

All that being said, I'll probably replace the CPX-1 with a CZ P-07 and a Crossbreed holster sometime this year. I carry a P3AT to work nowadays, as it's even smaller, ighter, easier to conceal and it's enough to get me the heck out of dodge. The Sccy has done it's job. Time to move on to something else.

jsid-1260118817-617323  geekWithA.45 at Sun, 06 Dec 2009 17:00:17 +0000

I too went from a compact .45 to a .38 snubby, now my daily carry gun is a flat baby 9; a Walther PPS, which has proven 101% reliable.

Having shot the P-11 & PF9, the Skye offering, as well as the roughly equivalent, slightly more expensive Kahrs, and also the Uberspendy Rorbaugh, I have to say the PPS is the best of the lot, and worth the extra money compared to the Keltecs & Skyes.

Of course, YMMV, each shooter is a unique biomechanical machine comprised of himself, his gun, and his budget.

My (semi-serious) recommendation for people happy with their Keltecs is to never shoot the Walther, as I've had more than one person tell me they were happy with their Keltec until they shot the Walther. I was one of them, the PF-9 was a serious contender until I handled and shot the PPS & M&P, effectively washing it out right before the final seleciton round.

Here's a post on the topic:


Putting aside all teh brand fanboyism, because your mileage really does vary, it just seems to me that these flat, lightweight and compact 9mms really do address the CCW use case pretty directly: you need a light, reliable, powerful gun that you're simply going to carry more than shoot. Considering my .45's spare mags weigh more than my PPS, and that 9mm with modern defensive ammo doesn't suffer any performance penalty, I just can't justify lugging 3 or 4 pounds of crap around with me everywhere I go all the time anymore.

jsid-1260124703-617329  LKP at Sun, 06 Dec 2009 18:38:23 +0000

I carry a Beretta 92 in an MTAC holster from Comptac. I can tuck a t-shirt in over it and nobody notices it. One downside, it gets really humid on summer nights in Tennessee and I had to replace my left side grip screws because my sweat caused them to rust (It's like a steam bath inside Walmart). Next spring I intend to get a Sigpro with a polymer grip to prevent that from recurring.

jsid-1260145649-617340  DirtCrashr at Mon, 07 Dec 2009 00:27:29 +0000

Kevin, go commando - wear un-tucked shirts and feel the breeze! :-)
I don't have many shirts that aren't Hawaiin anyhow, besides tucking-in is so Ninties.

jsid-1260152663-617345  emdfl at Mon, 07 Dec 2009 02:24:23 +0000

By all means let us know how this works out. I've been considering trading up from the P3AT to the PF-9 myself. I like my P3AT, but I've been thinking about moving up to something with a little more ummph; but without the weight penalty of the other 9's that I own.

jsid-1260176315-617359  Jerry the Geek at Mon, 07 Dec 2009 08:58:35 +0000

Everyone to his/her own.

I like the Kel-Tec P3-AT ( http://tinyurl.com/y89f8wp)
because it's light and easy to carry.

I have the 'belt clip' attached to the side screw, so there's no need for a holster. It doesn't work if you hook it on the belt, because it's too easy to brush off.

But if you tuck the pistol inside your trouser waistband, and the clip between the waistband and the belt, it's a positive 'safe and reliable' IWB carry without the added need for a holster.

(Note: best to have a long shirt-tail, because the day-long carry can cause serious skin abrasion without a cloth between the grip and the waist ... which is true with any similar carry.)

YMMV, but it's light, unobtrusive, and easy to get into the habit of carrying. Also, there's a minimal profile, especially if you have enough outer shirt to hide half-inch of pistol which rides above the waistband.

Perhaps not as 'hide-able' as a pocket holster, but much more accessible.

jsid-1260214524-617383  TheGunGeek at Mon, 07 Dec 2009 19:35:24 +0000

I carry a P3AT all the time. For those that hadn't heard me say it elsewhere, I carried it in my pocket for 14 months before my wife even knew it was there. That's how concealed they are. Or how much crap I carry in my pockets. One of the two.

The PF9 is .65" longer, .8" taller, and .11" wider than the P3AT. Not much bigger, but definitely bigger. What's kind of odd is that the P11 is the same height as the PF9, but the length is actually a quarter inch shorter on the P11. The difference between the width of the P3AT and the PF9 (.11") is basically the same as the difference between the PF9 and the P11, namely .12" wider at an even 1" width. It's also the same basic difference in loaded weights. The P3AT weighs in at 11.1 ounces, the PF9 at 15.5 and the P11 at 20.

Put the P3AT in your pocket every day and within a week or two you'll virtually forget it's there.

They're all more than accurate enough.

jsid-1260286854-617435  Kevin Baker at Tue, 08 Dec 2009 15:40:54 +0000

In answer to some of the questions:

I like my Minotaur quite a lot, but I don't like wearing it directly against my skin. Personal preference, and one reason I don't wear an untucked shirt when I carry. My Minotaur has the clips with velcro, and I wear a Beltman belt with a velcro strip on the inside. It. Doesn't. MOVE. Highly recommended.

When I tuck in a shirt, it's TUCKED, not bloused out over my belt, so the tail provides no concealment of the grip of my 1911. Thus I need an overgarment (jacket or unbuttoned, untucked shirt) to cover that. (And the spare magazine on my belt.)

jsid-1260624300-617702  Fits at Sat, 12 Dec 2009 13:25:00 +0000

Sweet little pea shooter.

jsid-1260672125-617720  Kevin Baker at Sun, 13 Dec 2009 02:42:05 +0000

Yeah, and those are .355" "peas," too!

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