JS-Kit/Echo comments for article at http://smallestminority.blogspot.com/2008/10/choices-choices.html (29 comments)

  Tentative mapping of comments to original article, corrections solicited.

jsid-1224817306-598114  emdfl at Fri, 24 Oct 2008 03:01:46 +0000

If you go over to falfiles.com, you can probably find someone who can build you an fnfal in whatever configuration you want for considerably less money.

jsid-1224818074-598116  Joe at Fri, 24 Oct 2008 03:14:34 +0000

Ted Brown is from the Reno area moved to OR several years ago. He still comes to the big gun show here. He has an outstanding reputation. If you get one his his guns you have a once in a lifetime investment and a precision tool. Also you can get a much better price on current production GI spec mags (CMI)at 44mag.com About $22ea.
On the other hand I have a friend that recently bought 2 different custom ordered DSA fals. One wouldn't cycle AT ALL and went back and the other wouldn't shoot worth a damn and was rebarreled by DSA. He just got it back...we'll see.

jsid-1224818236-598117  Joe at Fri, 24 Oct 2008 03:17:16 +0000

And I meant to add that for an extra $500 , why are you even asking????

jsid-1224818929-598118  Unix-Jedi at Fri, 24 Oct 2008 03:28:49 +0000

Would you consider the AR action at all?


Those look nifty - and most importantly, unlike most AR-10 and variants... takes FAL magazines.

jsid-1224819543-598119  Kevin Baker at Fri, 24 Oct 2008 03:39:03 +0000

Would you consider the AR action at all?

Not for this.

jsid-1224819766-598121  Kevin Baker at Fri, 24 Oct 2008 03:42:46 +0000

Also you can get a much better price on current production GI spec mags (CMI)at 44mag.com About $22ea.

See what I mean about great readers?:)

jsid-1224820472-598122  pdb at Fri, 24 Oct 2008 03:54:32 +0000

Have you considered a G3 clone?

PTR makes a pretty good one that's 100% backwards compatible with gen-u-wine H&K rifles. They're easy to scope, have bolt-on cheekpieces and other useful bits, and are intrinsically accurate. The triggers are hit or miss, but hey, $3 magazines.

They do mangle the brass somewhat, but that only matters if you're reloading, and the flutes can be carefully pressed out a couple times.

Plus, they look bad-ass, and are guaranteed to make a GFW piss his pants.

jsid-1224821047-598123  Kevin Baker at Fri, 24 Oct 2008 04:04:07 +0000

I had (for a three-day inspection) once a G3 clone.

Aside from the fact it was a Century piece of garbage that mangled the noses of HARDBALL ammo, it TRASHED the ejected brass, which I understand is typical for that rifle. The fluted chambers are not a reloader's friend.

jsid-1224822121-598124  ben at Fri, 24 Oct 2008 04:22:01 +0000

Have you thought about the 6.8spc now, especially that they've figured out that a lower rate of twist with 4-groove rifling gives velocities pushing 3000fps with, IIRC, 110gn projectiles?

I sure liked mine. Home build, crummy mil-spec trigger, and grouped 1/2" at 100 yards without even trying.

You mentioned follow-up shots... well, the 6.8 recoil is a fair bit lower than that of the 7.62x51.

jsid-1224825581-598126  Less at Fri, 24 Oct 2008 05:19:41 +0000

I love my FALs! I've got 3! In fact I shoot with the guys from DSA a lot (they are 5 minutes, literally, down the street in the next county over...)

If you're thinking of a FAL, order through a dealer and through DSA. They price will be better. A std FAL will run ~1399.

Looks like you want to build a precision semi-auto. The m14 might be a better option.

Don't get me wrong, the FAL is pretty accurate, but it's not going to shoot as well as a tricked out LRB or springfield.

That said, if you're hell bent on building a precision rifle, why a fixed 6x scope?

jsid-1224833774-598128  Homer at Fri, 24 Oct 2008 07:36:14 +0000

RE: mangled G3/91 brass: HK used to make a brass buffer that clips onto the top of the receiver and provides a rubber pad at the back edge of the ejection port to prevent denting the brass. It does work, and the bonus is the brass doesn't get thrown as far so it's easier to find.

As for fluted brass, it doesn't seem to affect reloading it at all.

jsid-1224856858-598131  Thag at Fri, 24 Oct 2008 14:00:58 +0000

Before you decide you _need_ a muzzle brake on an FAL, be sure to shoot a stock one. Climb is not that bad.

An M1A or AR10 is going to be more accurate than an FAL. I say that as an SA58 owner, by the way.

jsid-1224857762-598133  mostly cajun at Fri, 24 Oct 2008 14:16:02 +0000

Don't write off the Armalite AR-10 series. I lost mine in a fire three years ago, but it was embarrassingly accurate, consistent ten-ring at 600 yards, less than an inch at a hundred with hornady premium .308 box ammo.


jsid-1224858403-598135  emdfl at Fri, 24 Oct 2008 14:26:43 +0000

And if you want to get crazy, you can get an fnfal built in 6.5X.308(.260) Remington. Think of it as a semi-auto 6.5 X55 Swede.

jsid-1224858735-598136  perlhaqr at Fri, 24 Oct 2008 14:32:15 +0000

I haven't done enough research to know if the idea works (may waste too much powder/kill the ballistics/some other unforeseen consequence) but an idea I've been rolling around my noggin lately is taking one of DSA's 11 inch uppers and permanently attaching a can to it to bump it back up over 16.5 bbl length. Sure, it's still an NFA item, but man, how cool would it be to have an integrally suppressed .308 battle rifle? and set up that way, at least it's only a one tax stamp gun.

It's still (well, theoretically, anyway) supersonic, so it's not going to be "silent" by any stretch of the imagination, but it still might get you to the point where you can fire it without plugs.

jsid-1224868967-598148  theirritablearchitect at Fri, 24 Oct 2008 17:22:47 +0000

Yeah, the G3 clones do chew up the brass, though I simply LOVE my PTR.

I bought mine not long after the first full batch came off the line with all new parts. She's a sweet shooter, and I still feel like a got a great deal, as the asking price of an M14 or a good DSA, as Kevin mentioned, is quite a bit steeper. And the mags are a good design, and cheap to boot!

Good luck with your rifle, which ever you decide to go with, sir.

jsid-1224869307-598151  Guest (anonymous) at Fri, 24 Oct 2008 17:28:27 +0000

the goatsied O scares me...

jsid-1224870733-598154  Kevin Baker at Fri, 24 Oct 2008 17:52:13 +0000

The REAL "O" scares ME!

jsid-1224870798-598155  DirtCrashr at Fri, 24 Oct 2008 17:53:18 +0000

I'd go with a Noveske in 7.62 since I'm a fan of the man's products, with a 16-inch barrel. The Leonidas is very interesting but NFA and 12+inches - while the longer barrel length is still supposed to be sub MOA... The videos are especially fun to watch, especially considering how stable the platform remains in full action...

jsid-1224871689-598158  Less at Fri, 24 Oct 2008 18:08:09 +0000

Unless you are shooting the OSW - which is scarier than a barrel of angry, AIDS monkeys - the climb is the last thing to worry about, especially since you can adjust the gas valve on the FAL to bleed off a bit more...

The .308's recoil in a semi-auto is NOT THAT BAD...


(No that isn't me...)

jsid-1224875951-598170  Rustmeister at Fri, 24 Oct 2008 19:19:11 +0000

There's no substitute for accuracy, go with the M14.

jsid-1224878834-598179  Kirk Parker at Fri, 24 Oct 2008 20:07:14 +0000

Genuine Springfield M1A's are available new at just under $1400 for the basic models. What's wrong with SA as a starting point?

jsid-1224885366-598191  straightarrow at Fri, 24 Oct 2008 21:56:06 +0000

I've owned mine for a very long time. Bought as a politically corrected mil-surp. Have been absolutely ecstatic with it. The thumbhole stock is handier than the original furniture, the absence of a flash-hider and bayonet lug kind of irk me, but the thing is extremely accurate and reliable.

I don't know what they bring now, but I only paid $450 for mine, again years ago. It wasn't new, but except for the rework to comply with the AWB that was coming, it has been a good buy. With no AWB in effect now, you might wish to consider going the mil-surp route if any are still available.

Or is this another item the rules changed on, causing an artificial shortage?

jsid-1224898913-598204  Draven at Sat, 25 Oct 2008 01:41:53 +0000

Its not an 'artificial shortage', its a 'Fulton has military contracts to fulfill' shortage.

jsid-1224899303-598205  Kevin Baker at Sat, 25 Oct 2008 01:48:23 +0000

What's wrong with SA as a starting point?

The level of precision I want it capable of. The $1400 gets me a Springfield receiver. The LRB M25 lugged receiver is really that much better.

jsid-1224905587-598211  Terry at Sat, 25 Oct 2008 03:33:07 +0000

Whatever stick you finally end up with, you cannot go wrong with a Night Force scope. I have an NXS 5.5-22 X 65 on my BMG 50. The NP-R1 reticle is the easiest ranging device I have ever used. And I've tried them all, nearly.

jsid-1224990734-598277  theirritablearchitect at Sun, 26 Oct 2008 03:12:14 +0000

"What's wrong with SA as a starting point?"

It's an investment casting, and while good, some have shone a tendency to stretch a bit after 5K rounds or so. LRB and the milsurp receivers, as well at the frickin' Chinese Polytechs are all forged units.

Enough to make me want to puke.

jsid-1225133746-598325  Eagle 1 at Mon, 27 Oct 2008 18:55:46 +0000


What is your data source for investment cast stretch? Name, Date, Address, details. While I'm not going to dispute the fact that a forged receiver MAY be better with 30-50k rounds downrange I think you MIGHT want to be meore careful making blanket statements like that on a gun blog.

Just Sayin'

Eagle 1

jsid-1225245216-598379  theirritablearchitect at Wed, 29 Oct 2008 01:53:36 +0000

Ken Royce.

He's a bit of a weirdo, but I'd trust his assessment. The man shoots A LOT.

Oh, and I wasn't making any sort of blanket statement.

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