JS-Kit/Echo comments for article at http://smallestminority.blogspot.com/2008/03/harry-carried-smith-in-afghanistan.html (42 comments)

  Tentative mapping of comments to original article, corrections solicited.

jsid-1206558866-589862  Rabbit at Wed, 26 Mar 2008 19:14:26 +0000

Sure looks like a MkIII BHP to me.

Nice hat. Wonder if he's planning to emigrate like his aunt Sarah? She's got a presence in Dallas. He can get a new hat with the Texas flag on it when he does.


jsid-1206559233-589863  Hunter at Wed, 26 Mar 2008 19:20:33 +0000

Rabbit beat me to it, Browning.


jsid-1206559819-589864  Kevin Baker at Wed, 26 Mar 2008 19:30:19 +0000

What am I missing? It looks to me like a S&W 39 except for the frame-mounted safety.

jsid-1206560919-589865  Roland the Headless Thompson G at Wed, 26 Mar 2008 19:48:39 +0000

Methinks Hi-Powah.

jsid-1206561061-589866  bill-tb at Wed, 26 Mar 2008 19:51:01 +0000

Gotta go with Browning high power ... Looks cocked and locked to me.

Texas is nice.

jsid-1206561640-589868  SayUncle at Wed, 26 Mar 2008 20:00:40 +0000

I'm w/ Kevin due to the safety. Who's Harry?

jsid-1206562237-589869  Unix-Jedi at Wed, 26 Mar 2008 20:10:37 +0000

That's a BHP with an ambi safety.

Don't look a thing like a Smith.

Smith's have the slide-mounted safeties, remember?

( http://world.guns.ru/handguns/hg01-e.htm )

BHP. As anyone with refinement *ahem* carries.

*ahem*. :)

jsid-1206562625-589870  Sailorcurt at Wed, 26 Mar 2008 20:17:05 +0000

No comment on his choice of firearms (I'll leave that to the experts) but his mode of carry seems a bit...unorthodox.

Oh...and...what is he, in Delta Farce??? That soldier needs a haircut.

jsid-1206565919-589872  Ahab at Wed, 26 Mar 2008 21:11:59 +0000

You know, When I look at that mode of carry, it would be pretty handy for getting at in a hurry if you were in a vehicle or something.

jsid-1206566324-589873  Jeff Wood at Wed, 26 Mar 2008 21:18:44 +0000


That is Prince Henry, second son of Charles and Diana. Known to the rest of us as Harry, he is a second lieutenant in some upmarket cavalry regiment, and managed to serve nearly six months in the 'Stan until blown by, among others, Matt Drudge. As well as leading his platoon, he served as a forward air controller.


We Brits have a tradition of being casual about hair and beards in the desert. I bet Rommel thought he was up against a bunch of pirates.

Browning, definitely.

jsid-1206568699-589876  Kevin Baker at Wed, 26 Mar 2008 21:58:19 +0000

OK, now I got it. You can't see the muzzle end of the slide, it's behind his hand. That's what screwed me up. The profile you can see has that odd slope of S&W auto pistols that just rubs me the wrong way. It absolutely has the Mk III grips.

And it's NOT cocked-n-locked unless it's equipped with the Safety-Fast-System hammer. That hammer is down.

jsid-1206573536-589879  Randy at Wed, 26 Mar 2008 23:18:56 +0000

I've seen other photos of him carrying the same piece. Definitely a BHP. There was some discussion about it on the BHP forums a month or so ago when the story broke.

jsid-1206574040-589880  Randy at Wed, 26 Mar 2008 23:27:20 +0000

Here's the threads I referred to:



jsid-1206576673-589881  Robert at Thu, 27 Mar 2008 00:11:13 +0000

He ought to get himself some nice Uncle Mike Rubber grips and drive the magazine safety out of that thing to make the trigger pull nicer.

Nice hat. I'll pay his TSRA membership fee if he moves to Texas.

jsid-1206583546-589884  Elijah at Thu, 27 Mar 2008 02:05:46 +0000

Look at the muzzle end of the pistol just above his wrist-bone. That little scallop from the front of the slide is Browning genes.

Plus the SW39 doesn't have a frame mounted safety AFAIK.

Time to invest in some glasses, mate?

jsid-1206586046-589886  William Earl Dungey at Thu, 27 Mar 2008 02:47:26 +0000

I think his manner of carry means he is serious about his tools, look at the other stuff he needs for his work, and the pistol is packed exactly where he can get to it when needed. I always laugh at low hanging leg holsters, when sitting in a vehicle especially, although they look sexy and ready when one dismounted, and looking sexy is important to young combat soldiers.

jsid-1206589075-589889  Sailorcurt at Thu, 27 Mar 2008 03:37:55 +0000

I will bow to you guys' expertise, I was a sailor, not a soldier. Having a sidearm thrust through the webbing just struck me as a bit...informal...for want of a better term.

But if that's what works in those conditions...better to be practicool than tacticool.

Hey, I think I just made up a word.

jsid-1206601291-589891  Will at Thu, 27 Mar 2008 07:01:31 +0000

Shame he couldn't find a proper chest holster to mount to his armour. If you look close, you can see where he removed two lines of thread from that strap to get a slot wide enough to hold his HP. Not the most secure way to carry it, especially if you have to move in any mode other than upright.

jsid-1206603214-589892  Hunter at Thu, 27 Mar 2008 07:33:34 +0000

Looking at Harry's uniform state, I'd venture to guess that he is just lolling around the laager. When going outside the wire or on duty at the TOC, I'm sure that he would be in the full kit, with his personal defense weapon in a proper holster, somewhere.

jsid-1206607427-589893  Draven at Thu, 27 Mar 2008 08:43:47 +0000

Found it.

Its a DA Browning Hi-Power...


Even has the ambi safety.

Set for right-hand draw, tho.

jsid-1206616324-589895  Steve at Thu, 27 Mar 2008 11:12:04 +0000

As the owner of BOTH a S&W M39 and a Browning HP, I confidently agree with the consensus: that's a Hi Power.


jsid-1206624467-589898  dfwmtx at Thu, 27 Mar 2008 13:27:47 +0000

Hey y'all are wondering what gun he's carrying, yet I'm wondering what a potential future soverign of England is doing wearing the Stars & Stripes. No Union Jacks in desert camo?

jsid-1206625436-589899  Mark Alger at Thu, 27 Mar 2008 13:43:56 +0000

My guess is the hat is part of a souvenir swap. His unit ran into a bunch of Yanks and they traded hats.


jsid-1206627122-589902  Randy at Thu, 27 Mar 2008 14:12:02 +0000


There is no such thing as a "DA Hi Power". That term is in the same category as "Semi-automatic Assault Rifle"

There is a DA Browning, and there is the Browning Hi-Power. All BHP's are single action. Calling that DA abomination a Hi Power is purely FN Marketing pukes at work. Consensus on the BHP boards (and my assessment) is that it is a BHP MK III.

If you look at the picture located at http://forums.1911forum.com/showpost.php?p=1743406&postcount=2
you can clearly see the spur hammer, which the DA lacks.

You can also see the hammer in the picture Kevin posted, but it's harder to see.

Speculation on the BHP boards is that he was carrying it in the Fairbairn-Sykes method, i.e. chamber empty hammer down. Notice that in the pictures not only is the hammer down but the safety is also in the down (fire) position. It would be at a 45 degree angle across the serrations on the rear of the slide if it was on safe. On a BHP you cannot put the safety "on safe" with the hammer down.

The assumption being that he (and his NCO's) are not stupid enough to carry it with hammer down on a loaded chamber.

jsid-1206627495-589903  Randy at Thu, 27 Mar 2008 14:18:15 +0000

Oh, and Kevin, I doubt it has the SFS mod. IIRC, with the SFS, when you push the hammer forward, the safety levers move to the "on safe" position. Taking the safety off moves the hammer back to the fire position. The safety in that picture is off, the hammer is down, hence not an SFS.

jsid-1206629098-589907  Kevin Baker at Thu, 27 Mar 2008 14:44:58 +0000


Yes, I know. I have one installed on a Kimber Classic. I concur with your analysis - he's carrying it hammer down on an empty chamber, safety off.

jsid-1206631711-589910  Breda at Thu, 27 Mar 2008 15:28:31 +0000

Harry was recently said that he doesn't like England that much - I don't blame him.

jsid-1206643540-589922  Mark at Thu, 27 Mar 2008 18:45:40 +0000

DA BHP with Ambi Safety, I second or third the move to texas :)

jsid-1206651199-589933  Tam at Thu, 27 Mar 2008 20:53:19 +0000

It's not a DA.

It's not a S&W.

It's a plain ol' UK military High Power.

jsid-1206655563-589937  Draven at Thu, 27 Mar 2008 22:06:03 +0000

Okay. Brit military HPs have the newer grips and ambi safeties? cool.

jsid-1206661588-589941  Kresh at Thu, 27 Mar 2008 23:46:28 +0000

The hat was probably a misdirect on the off change that somebody saw him. You know, "That's not the Prince. Why on earth would the Prince be wearing THAT hat?"

Alternately, he's showing the poofy bastards running parliment who really has the right take on things. Protip: Not them.

jsid-1206666716-589944  Inspector at Fri, 28 Mar 2008 01:11:56 +0000

I think it's pointed in a very... interesting direction when he sits down, is what I think.

Rule 2?

jsid-1206671019-589948  Kevin Baker at Fri, 28 Mar 2008 02:23:39 +0000

That might explain why it's hammer-down on an empty chamber!

jsid-1206671218-589949  Less at Fri, 28 Mar 2008 02:26:58 +0000

"I think it's pointed in a very... interesting direction when he sits down, is what I think.
Rule 2?"

Plenty of people carry appendix or front of the chest...

Generally speaking, when a gun is holstered, then where it points is not that much of an issue...

Especially with big molle vests, strong side hip or whatever isn't that great...

He doesn't have to worry about hiding the damn thing - he's a soldier...

jsid-1206735010-589976  Mk VII at Fri, 28 Mar 2008 20:10:10 +0000

British Brownings (all FN ones by now, purchased between the '60s and the present) have been refitted with new slides with the decent sights that you can see at last and the horrid factory contoured grips that make your hand ache and the ambidex safety of dubious usefulness. I doubt we will see the back of the HP for many years - no money for replacement.

jsid-1206752106-589985  Randy at Sat, 29 Mar 2008 00:55:06 +0000

"I doubt we will see the back of the HP for many years "

You say that like it's a bad thing1 :-)

jsid-1206819986-590002  Brass at Sat, 29 Mar 2008 19:46:26 +0000

I can't seem to find it just now, but there is a picture of him from the rear wearing the same hat. The back says, "We do bad things to bad people." You go Harry!

jsid-1206820450-590003  Brass at Sat, 29 Mar 2008 19:54:10 +0000

The back of his hat reads, "We do bad things to bad people." Kick ass, Harry.

jsid-1206820475-590004  Brass at Sat, 29 Mar 2008 19:54:35 +0000

Oops, sorry for the double post.

jsid-1206947337-590080  Cindi at Mon, 31 Mar 2008 07:08:57 +0000

Swiped, posted at Powerline Forum, and attributed.

Gotta love it, Kevin, thanks.

jsid-1207379587-590361  cmblake6 at Sat, 05 Apr 2008 07:13:07 +0000

I was 13 years old before I learned Damn and Yankee were two separate words. And I've got my Brit Beret that I swapped a brigadier for to this day. That was over 20 years ago. I salute you in honour, Noble Prince of the Realm!

jsid-1207379694-590362  cmblake6 at Sat, 05 Apr 2008 07:14:54 +0000

"My guess is the hat is part of a souvenir swap. His unit ran into a bunch of Yanks and they traded hats."
Oops, forgot the c&p. Sorry, fixed.

 Note: All avatars and any images or other media embedded in comments were hosted on the JS-Kit website and have been lost; references to haloscan comments have been partially automatically remapped, but accuracy is not guaranteed and corrections are solicited.
 If you notice any problems with this page or wish to have your home page link updated, please contact John Hardin <jhardin@impsec.org>